God says to honor him with the first fruits of increase - the tithe. Yes, she should give 10%, however, God also saw the widow with the 2 mites and said she gave more than the rich who were faithful to tithe, so even beyond the "Law" of 10% tithe, is the importance of the giving heart. God's Word says that the cheerful giver is the one who pleases God. So untimately, 10% is the minimum goal, but if she starts with 5% cheerfully, God will make a way for 10%, then to go beyond the 10% to add offerings while increasing her supply supernaturally and blessing her. He is the God of increase, El Shaddai. He will increase her.
 

Galations 6:7 tells us that "God is not mocked, whatsoever a man soweth he shall also read". If you want tomatoes you have to plant tomato seeds, if you want watermelons you have to plant watermelon seeds,ect. If you want money, you have sow money. This principle applies to frequency as well as the amounts. if you want money everyday, you should sow money everyday. My wife and I started sowing money every day 6 years ago and we recieve money everyday now. What you sow is no as important as the regularity (sometimes it was just a penny). We tried this principle and is working for us. We now never miss a tithe. It is hard to do when you are in a tight at first, but i you can get the nerve up to do tithe faithfully and sow everyday for one month in faith, you will never ever go back!!!

Pastor Ben
 

Hello Pastor Ben,

Can you tell me how you receive money everyday?
 

I light of this new sypathetic revelation that obedience to God is subject to "our ability" to obey I want to suggest the follow amendments to the ten commandments.
1) Thou shall have no other God before me (except if you came from a country where you were raised with multiple God's and your life was built around worshipping all of them. Then you may only have to give up 1/2 of your former Gods.
2)THou shall not steal ( unless you have true needs then it is ok if you say your sorry.)
3) Thou shall not covet ( unless you have been addicted to internet pornography then you may covet but only in the privacy of your own home.
4) Thou shall not bare false witness ( unless you are afraid that if you tell the truth it will cause you extreme personal hardship then you may lie to protect yourself)

We could add more but these are good to start with. Thank you for presenting such a socially sensitive Gospel
 

I'm not a pastor, and I firmly believe in Tithing - It is my personal habit to give my tithe even before i start thinking about what bills i need to pay. (don't rob God)

However, I do live in a place where there are people with lesser means than I do. Such people are affected by the swing of the economy, and with every downturn of the economy, their financial situation suffers.

Its hard to try to tell an elderly lady who has just closed her cafe that she needs to tithe. Its equally hard to tell a brother (who is jobless and trying hard to look for a job) that he needs to give his tithe when all he receives from social welfare is really minimal.

for both of them, they love God and serve Him in other ways - e.g. doing free "services" for which they would normally be paid.. e.g. cooking for the whole church, carpentry, sanitary work (cleaning out the drains), computer maintenance for the church office - they give willingly without expecting anything in return..

in addition, they tried to bear the "seed costs" (raw material, equipment, etc) required for what they are doing such that it doesn't cost the church a single cent. .. and what they gave is definitely greater in worth than the 10% of what they have.

how would you evaluate this then? are they giving? in my opinion, certainly. is it 10% of their money? nope. if the church were to pay them for their work, would it be more than 10% of their tithe? definitely.

would anyone care to comment on this?
 

Guys, you're missing the whole point here. Tithing is not a law for Christians, because Christ set a new standard: to live our lives 100 percent for Him, and steward the resources He entrusted to us in a way that is honouring God and bringing justice. That opens the whole area of giving and generosity up, and doesn't condition it to 10 percent. Christians are not under the law, or are you guys also circumcised? If you keep the law, then keep the whole law, don't leave most things out except tithing and the ten commandments. Besides for the people of Israel the tithe was 23.3 percent. Who of you is giving that percentage away?
 

Your first fruits are more than just your money. Fruit(S) consider your time, skill, talent, etc. If we had christian only giving 10% of their money and not 10% of all that God has given them, we would have some messed up churches. Perhaps this is the problem in our churches. We continue to let the world influence the Body of Christ. Cheerfully give your time, your skills, your ability, cheerfully give your tithe, your first fruits, only you know what God had given you and I am sure it's more than just money, If you lack money, give what you have. Not grudgingly or out of necessity. But remember God loves a cheerful giver. So give every chance you get. The more you give to more he will give to you. Long life, Good Health, Loving Relationships and Money. And remeber to whom much is given much is required.
 

Reading the above comments I am struck by the obsessive vision on only the woman who is struggling. Isn't it interesting that all these pontificators have completely ignored the man who is selfishly whoarding upon his own lusts that blessings that God has allowed him to have as his responsibility.

Perhaps we need to keep in mind the parable of the talents and recall that the Lord required every single person to account for ALL their talents whether they be 1 or 10.

We want all of God's blessings but we don't want Him to direct all our choices. Aren't we hypocrites?! We are more than willing to criticize the single mom/widow, but we have no comment for the rich man whose possessions continue to blow his own horn?
 

I don't believe in the tithe and anybody that promotes the tithe puts people in bondage of an old testament law. In fact, the concept of "full-time ministry" is also unbiblical. I believe in giving, in caring for the poor and the needy. There is a more important issue here. Who do we serve? God or Mammon? Consider that Mammon is a real deity - the god of money. If you were offered a choice - Choose riches, wealth, prosperity and Mammon or choose poverty and serving God with a pure heart? What would you choose if the distinction was not very clear, as if you were seeing the 2 choices in a mist? Are you prepared to serve the Most High whether you get financial gain or not? Before you make assumptions, He has blessed me financially and I lean heavily upon His grace and provision. Therefore there is place of blessing in Him, but we need to know who we serve!
 

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Please do not post the content of entire dissertations or Web sites in the comments section. However, feel free to provide links to outside resources that reinforce your comments. Thanks!
 

i have believed in tithing for many years, but recently i have started to feel that its not what God wants of me. i have studied the scriptures and i realize that we are no longer under that law. i think the church has become so materialistic and preaching that we are giving to receive, not giving because we love God and want so support the work of the Gospel. Christ commands us to give. we should be doing things to reach out to the poor and underserved...showing the world the love of Christ, not putting bowling allies in our churches. God now lives inside us...we are the church. finances should be used to build up the spirit of the people, not build big mega churches like the synogogues of Jesus' times. my other issues is also with "full time" ministry, meaning the pastor lives off the $$ of the church. i do believe the church should honor its leader, but i dont think he should receive a salary from the church and then go play golf all day. to sum up my point, i belive that we as Christians should give, as God has instructed our hearts - not by a law that was fulfilled on the cross. we should want to be like Christ and give all we have to God's work, our time, talent, and finances and not be locked into 10%.
 

What would happen if the rich man in the story would have taken some of his riches to help his new sister in Christ who is struggling to pay her bills and still trying help pay the church's bills? There is not one word in all the New Testament to command or even suggest that New Covenant believers are supposed to tithe. While the New Testament is silent on the duty of Christians to tithe, it is not silent on the subject of giving, but rather quite vocal. God doesn't simply want 10% of your money, He wants 100% of who you are, time, talents, etc. I would rather see the rich Christians money invested in helping those in their congregation and community who need help than helping fund the new gold plated fixtures for the church building. When we understand New Testament stewardship we understand what it means to serve Christ 100% daily without the bondage of a 10% requirement once a week.

www.unleashingthechurch.com
 

I have been a tither and I have been NOT a tihter, I have seen blessings financial and otherwise and I have experienced loss. Neither were tied into my 'tithing." I have given abundantly and lost high paying jobs, I have not given and been blessed with new homes, vacations and evertything we are "supposed to have" here in the US. The constant harping of tithing or else you are robbing God make people feel guily, in bondage and unable to experience the joy and absolute love of our Savior. Giving and Serving financially and otherwise are demanded of our Lord. But the OT structure no longer applies when Jesus Christ says unless you are willing to give ALL or 100% of your life, money and other resources you are not worthy. The 10% rule keeps those who have 'secure' in there giving (and salavtion) and those who don't condemed. The modern church today spreads this gospel of materialism and greed and I wonder how many "called" ministries would actually cease if the funds would dry up? I prefer to give to missionaries, the poor, the hungry, world relief, and still give cheerfully to my loacal assembly to keep the building functional, staff and Pastors paid etc. But I will no longer subject myself or family to the bondage of tithing. Only Faith and Obdience please God. He commands to give and 'leads' to give.
 

I live on a fixed income and don't have a job. I cheerfully tithe way more than 10% of my time and my talents to the church, volunteering 4-6 days a week for 6-8 hours a day. But when my church tallys up receipts at tax time, my record shows I have given nothing. I don't think my church actually recognizes anything but the money plate or they don't know how to equate precious time with money. And if you have unusually creative talents, how can you find a price or replacement? But there still should be recognition for tithing time and talents. Freely given, these are more important than money any day and they actually create more wealth for the church. But only God seems to recognize this.
 

11th Commandment:
Thou shalt tithe, and thou shalt not teach against tithing- for the tithe is the "third rail" of the church - teach against it and die.

I used to be in a small group at my church. At one meeting the leader boasted about how he and his wife tithed and stated that if we weren't tithing we were in sin.

I totally agree that the church needs to put just as much recognition into non-monetary giving as is given to monetary giving. Unfortunately, non-monetary giving is not "tax deductible" for income tax purposes and the typical church today is heavily committed to their tax exempt status.
 

Speaking to Aaron, God says as recorded in Num 18:21 "I give to the Levites all the tithes in Israel as their inheritance in return for the work they do while serving at the Tent of Meeting."

It should be clear from this passage that tithing is not "giving", but a payment for services, namely "the work they do while serving at the Tent of Meeting."

The Christian must also realize due to the thorough treatment done in Hebrews 7 that the this work (sacrificial rites) is no longer done (for it is complete) and that there exist no priests (for their work is complete) to whom to pay a tithe.

If the tithe is a payment for services, and the services are no longer rendered, it is obvious that the tithe is no longer paid.

Furthermore, paying the tithe is an act of faith, that the sacrificial services still continue, and in turn that Jesus was not the last sacrifice, and therefore, the Christian has no hope. Therefore we say then that a Christian paying the tithe is committing a gross act of unbelief, or anti-faith.

My 75 odd page study on this topic can be had per request. scott.brians@gmail.com

*************
A few years back I discovered that the tithe is not for the Christian. I promised God that I would give FAR LESS than 10% as an act of faith!

Inside of a week we obtained a contract, with no effort on our part, to perform work through our consulting company.

We made more money in 3 months than I could make as an engineer (Masters in Electrical Engineering) in 3 years - the effort expired was a few quick phone calls.

How is that for a tithe testimomy! God stands true to His Word indeed. I know of many others who have experienced the same!

Regards,
Scott Brians
 

We as human beings try ever so hard too interpret and impart what God over time has said too us....yet in our endeavors each of us becomes religous in our own "personal" ways. Tithing is a principle that works...ask the wealthiest people in the world and you will typically find tithers whether they're Bible believers or not.

However in my limited exposure in ministry (ten years) there are simply times when too expect certain families to tithe...and certain times when we as the church should consider tithing certain families.

We as the church typically deal with the spiritual man and we leave the soul man out in the cold...we are spiritual beings living in a natural world with natural demands and pressure. Might our tithing of a family in need cause that family to be allowed freedom...and them the ability to tithe?

A serious question...subject to all of our personal beliefs or "doctrines"....but there are people out there right now that have grieved hearts because of their desire to tithe out of an income that refuses them the leeway...and there are families out there that could cause that leeway to surface.

The end result both schools of though find themselves winners...tithers have been used to develop other tithers,,,and Jesus gets the glory from what man has done for each other.
 

Comment on article by Matt Green:

My take is to rid the article of all references to "tithe" and just stick with the term "giving".

All statements implying that "one is not giving unless it is at least XYZ%" should be removed, for God tells us to give as we determine, not how another determines.

The poorly named "reverse tithe" is something I have dreamed about, but I am not there yet.

An additional giving method idea is the "lump sum inside of a predefined time frame". Why should giving calculations be limited to a %?

Handling the perhaps bigger question of "to whom should I give" could be handled. But then the article may become long.

Regards,
Scott Brians
 

The Word of God is the Word of God, whether the old testament or new testament. Just because something is not equally stated in the new testament that is mentioned in the old ("tithing") does not mean that the principle has been removed. Of course, we are not living in biblical times. Times have changed, however, our God remains the same. Tithing has to do with money. Nothing else. man has associated tithing with "time and talents" but God never did. Consider, the Apostle Paul through the Holy Spirit speaks alot about "giving" because the majority of his audience was already familiar with "tithing." Tithing was a part of the Israelite lifestyle so the Apostle Paul had no need to reinforce or introduce a new concept. Giving on the other hand, was a new concept for them. Giving goes beyond the tithe. Giving and whatever we do goes beyond the law, the outer focus and goes deeper into the inward focus. I am a tither and I will continue to tithe. I have tithed on much and on little. I teach my church the blessings of tithing, the blessings of giving offerings, and the blessings of sowing seeds. Not that the church or the pastor can become "richer" (God will provide for all of our needs according to His riches in glory), but because this is His way to economically empower the people. "Where your treasure is, there your heart will be also." I also teach my church about seeking wisdom from God on how the 90% should be saved, spent and sown. When we truly seek first His Kingdom and His righteousness, then these things shall be added unto us.
 

i have proven it does not work. PROVEN IT. i gave 25% for about 15 years. i was driving a beat up car, waiting for a return. i still living in a apt. today, everyone else my age ownes thier house today. while i was giving it away.
i droped from 25% to 10% so i can finnally get myself something. i got a new car instead of giving that extra 15% away. and now i am saving for a house . i gave it all away waiting for a return that never came.

good-by.
 

"Just because something is not equally stated in the new testament that is mentioned in the old ("tithing") does not mean that the principle has been removed." -anonymous

So, what other Old Testament principles do you teach your flock that they must obey? As stated in another post, a proper examination of tithing by the Israelites indicates they paid 20% to 30% in tithes. Do you teach your flock 10% tithe or 30%? Do you require circumcision of males in your church? Hold them to all of the practices, feasts and celebrations of the Israelites?

When Jesus said from the cross "it is finished", did He mean everything except the requirement to tithe? Does Romans 8:1-2 (Therefore there is now no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus. For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus has set you free from the law of sin and of death. NASB) have the "unless if you don't tithe" exception?

Finally, to all the Shepherds who teach their flocks the "biblical" requirement to tithe- are you prepared to "render unto Caesar that which is Caesar's" and give up your tax exempt status? Why should the church not have to pay taxes?
 

Read the Bible and let the Holy Spirit teach you what to do about money. The problem with most Christians today is that they leave it up to someone else to do that for them. If we will seek God, through His word, He will let us know what to do about tithing as well as and other ways of trusting Him.
 

Fortunately Jesus defines the "weighter Matters" and they are not liquidation but rather Justice and righteousness. I do agree that the New testament standard id greater that the Olt Testament standard (which was much more that just one 10% tithe - it also included offerings, first fruits, tithes for Levites, leaving the corners of ones field for the poor and more). I bleieve that the standard Jesus commends when it comes to giving is the pooe widod in Mark 12:41-44. here jesus reminds us that we are to life a life that requires us to trust in God and not in our income, bank account, investments or retirement. Our treasure is to be in heaven because we simply CANNOT serve two masters (Mat 6:19-24). It is a difference between ownership and stewardship. I have developed the following charts to help with this topic.

Attitude of Man
1. It’s more blessed to receive
than give.
Word of God
1. It is more blessed to give
than to receive. Acts 20:35
Attitude of Man
2. Give and you will loose.
Word of God
2. Give and you will gain true
and lasting riches. Mk. 10:28-
30; Mat. 6:19,20,33; Lk. 6:38
Attitude of Man
3. Keep and you will gain
more.
Word of God
3. Keep and you will loose true
riches. Lk. 12:13-21; 16:25,26
Attitude of Man
4. Life consists in what a
person has.
Word of God
4. A man's life does not consist
in the abundance of his
possessions. Lk. 12:15
Attitude of Man
5. If you have financial
problems cut back on your
giving.
Word of God
5. If you have financial
problems make sure that
God is not being robbed.
Malachi 3:8-10
Attitude of Man
6. Keep your money because
you earned it.
Word of God
6. Your very ability to produce
earnings is from God so be
generous. Deut. 8:17,18; Lk.
12:32-33

Ownership
1. Own our possessions.
Stewardship
1. We manage the possessions that belong to another - God.
Ownership
2. Am responsible only to myself
Stewardship
2. We are responsible to the owner - God.
Ownership
3. We can do what we please with our possessions.
Stewardship
3. We manage the possessions in our care according to the
directives given by the owner.
Ownership
4. We have no requirements placed on us.
Stewardship
4. We have one basic requirement placed on us: Faithfulness (1
Cor. 4:2)
Ownership
5. We are or become self focused.
Stewardship
5. We are or become focused on the will and glory of the owner - God.
 

wow , all that i have read is good so far to make one think, i have been born again since 1976, i love God with all my heart soul and mind. I have been in church ever since and been beaten up by myself about the tithe, i have tithed more and i have tithed less, i have been in the pew and had no food in my house and i have fed many, i love to give and i know how to give and when to give i also have missed oppertunities to give. I am very sad over the church and those in leadership of the church that do not teach how to give because they do not know except what they were taught, and by who were they taught anyway. It is sad to see how the church as a whole struggle in finances, some due to ignorance and some due to sin, i have only been praised for tithing because it was monitored due to being in leadership, i was never praised for the countless sunday school classes for 14 years or the food i helped cook or well it doesnt matter i did it because i loved doing it and i knew i was giving part of me, also the last time i checked christ lives in me, the holy spirit works through me and if i give to the least i'm giving to God.. did he say that was just money?
 

"5. If you have financial
problems make sure that
God is not being robbed.
Malachi 3:8-10 " - denis

Where in the Scripture do you find that tithing protects you from financial problems? I believe Job would probably argue this point with you.

Everyone should read Malachi 3 in its entirety and understand the CONTEXT of who is being addressed - the nation of Israel. If you want to use Malachi 3:8, then until the entire nation tithes, then we cannot receive the described protections and blessings.
 

Wake up Christians....your giving is according to II Cor: 9:12.
As I give with a willing heart, my God is able to make all GRACE, every favor and earthly blessing, come to me in abundance...so that I may always and in all circumstances, and whatever the need, be self-sufficient, possessing enough to require no aid or support and furnished in abundance for every good work and charitable donation. All of such giving brings thanksgiving and glory to God. He is the one who provides seed for sowing and bread for eating. Trust in the Lord....not the empty promises and urgings of others on how much you should give.
Ask the Holy Spirit to lead you and guide you. Even
ask Him for a giving and generous heart. It all begins
HIm.
 

Tithing is neither OT or NT. Tithing was first spoken of during the time Abram returned from the battle of the kings. Abram brought to Melchizedek ten percent of the spoils from that battle. When Moses was given the law, (specifically in the area of tithing) the law served as a national regulation on tithing for the whole nation. However, prior to the law, tithing was and still is a matter of covenant between man and God. When preachers and people use 2 Cor. 8 and 9, it should only be used in the context of giving. Nothing has ever been said in that passage about tithing. The principle of tithing works because God always blesses His people with this ability. More often than not, in neighborhoods where I live, Brooklyn, NY, rent is high, gas is high, food is high, medical, dental and other health care cost are high, utilities are high. There is no doubt in my mind that they are high in other places where people live. Yet,there are those who will struggle and those who won't. Amazingly, the church has failed to focus on the right balance for the purpose of tithing. Sometimes, there is a push to tithe that become so radical that when there isn't instant blessing, disillusionment sets in and discourage many believers from ever tithing again. Tithing or givingn offerings is not lotto. While reciprocity is embedded in tithing and giving offerings, this is not the main focus. Tithing honors God. Offerings help our fellow believers. Instead of looking to be blessed, we need to understand that God blesses us to be a blessing to others. Also we shouldn't be looking for that "miracle blessing of debt reduction". We need the miracle of a personal budget. We have to treat the temptation to over spend like the tree of the knowledge of good and evil. For in the day we overspend we shall surely end up over our heads. The lesson of the prodigal or wasteful spender is still a valid lesson experienced by many today. It's time to sober up and get back to the very funamentals in the area of balanced teaching in this area before more believers end up hurt and would never tithe or give again.
 

Let's consider Abraham. He conquers the enemy, take (perhaps steal!) their stuff and give 10% of that stuff away. He did not give 1% of his own. Besides that incident, the tithe was not a principle until the law came.
And all of the tithe preachers today also do not teach what the law says.

The law states that you give 10% of your increase once a year. Deut 14:22 That is of your annual profits, not income.

Every 3rd year the entire tithe (increase of that same year)was given to the Levites and the poor. Deut 14:27-29, Deut 26:12, Amos 26:12. This tithe was not brought to the temple. The Levites functioned as magistrates, school teachers etc. Therefore tithing in ancient Israel was Income Tax.

The priests did not get a tithe directly from the people at all. The Levites gave a 10% of the tithe to the priests. Num 18:26,28.

Every family was expected to go to Jerusalem once a year. Deut 14:23 This was not for the Levite nor the priest. Some of the tithe was used to defray the expenses for the trip. They were eating and drinking from their own tithes! Deut 14:24-26 "...thou shall bestow that money for whatsoever thy soul lusteth after (buy whatever you want)... or for wine, or for strong drink (it is in the Bible!) and thou shalt eat before the Lord thy God and thou shalt rejoice!"

Any preacher saying that they tithe and it works for them - really? It only works because they put others under condemnation. Who is robbing God?
 

Thank goodness most of the posters have avoided the "God understands why we can't obey" mentality...

Is tithing for today? Maybe, maybe not BUT, "if you see your brother in need" surely is...where does that stop?? 10%?

One friend told me 10% is a GUIDELINE so we aren't giving LESS than the Old Covenent...he said he tried the give as needed mentality and found he had given less than 10%...so he went to a basic set aside 10% guideline.

pastor joel missed the WHOLE POINT of the 2 mites story...the POOR widow gave EVERYTHING she had...she did NOT ask God to understand her situation and give 1/2 a mite. She gave 100%!!

One person says that Abraham is the only mention of a tithe before the law. What about Jacob?

Another person says they gave 25% and waited for a return that never came...yikes! That would definitely be dealt with under the Corinthian passage of a "cheerful giver".

Sadly, Ron Sider has another book that addresses the issue of why American evangelicals act just like unbelievers. It is easy to see why... he is using his reasoning to justify disobedience. Can't anyone see the connection??

I BELIEVE the church should be living on less and using more for the kingdom...I am a missionary. I live in a foreign country 24/7.

BUT the ENDS do NOT justify the MEANS!!! Trying to "build up to obedience" is definitely not New Testament...

We should be obedient to God while seeking to live on less and less for ourselves. Using our God given resources 100% for the kingdom of God. Then maybe we could show the world what the kingdom of God is supposed to look like...
 

Check out these links:
http://www.inplainsite.org/html/tele-evangelist_lifestyles.html

LEARN THE TRUTH ABOUT TITHING ONCE AND FOR ALL

http://www.inplainsite.org/html/tithing.html
 

Well, there is nothing new under the sun, and I think after reading the responses, I can say "Now, I've heard it all".

But wait. Jesus said something to the effect that you search the scriptures, because you think you will find life in them, but all they really do is tell you about me, and here I am, standing before you, and you don't recognize me.

Is it about money? Is it about time or talents? Is it law or grace?

I think not. It is really about Jesus. Given any circumstance of life, do we reflect the desire and purpose of the Christ or do we practice iniquity (witch-craft) and abuse scripture to manipulate souls to conform to our interpretation?

I think Paul was totally sold out to Jesus, yet with respect to financial status he says something to the effect that I have learned that whatever situation I am in, whether wealthy or impoverished, I can do all things through Christ who enables me.

No, 10%, not 23.3% nor "reverse tithe" (interesting term) is sufficient in the light of the cross.

God has a wonderful plan for you. He wants YOU dead, only then can the Christ live in you.

Blessings,

eli_w@hotmail.com
 

I am a minister and missionary. I not only tithed, but gave up all to go to a third world country to minister to those poorer than myself. The agrument seems to be to tithe or not to tithe. First, one should really read the Bible and find out what was done with the tithe. It was to support the priests (the ministry people) and it was also given to the poor. What I see if that the tithe is under the control of one-fifth of the five fold ministry, and it is doled out in very small amounts to the other four-fifths. Just ask any evangelist or missionary if they have enough money to even live on. Missionaries are coming home in droves. Not because of the hardship of the mission field, but almost always because of not enough money to even pay their bills and eat, let alone do ministry. And what about the poor. Oh, some have a bread pantry, of stale bread and a few canned goods, which are donated at no cost to the church. Why are we not helping the poor? Why do we demand the tithe of the people and not comply with the Bible as to how it is distributed? I believe every minister of God should be provided for. But is it right that the pastor drives to church in a Lexus or a Hummer and his people are still poor? Is it right that American pastors live a rich lifestyle, while those who are willing to do the hardest of ministry work cannot get even a few dollars of support? While I was on the field, a few very small churches gave $25 a month, faithfully, out of their own poverty. Yet when I approached big churches who had the capacity to really help, they could not be bothered. God is not the accountant in this ministry business. I could have lived the rest of my life on the mission field on the cost of many church's sound and TV systems. Maybe tithers need to start asking for accountability. If you are required to give, maybe you should make sure it is being distributed Biblically. I know that mostly pastors will read this, and most likely would like to stone me. But it is Bible. Don't push the Bible down people's throats if you are not willing to comply with it yourself. If you would like to know more on what the Bible says about the distribution of the tithe, you may contact me, stones and all, at missionaryschoolca@yahoo.com.
From one who has given all,
Rev. Lenz
 

10% tithing is just a guide for mankind as stated in the Bible.Whether you want to give more or less is up to you because it is your hard earned and also its between you and GOD.
 

Kudos Matt...I love it when you bring up points that most in the church don't want to deal with. Bottom line. The Kingdom principle taught in Scripture is that all that we have comes from God and belongs to Him. We are to be good stewards of the time, talent and TREASURE that He provides. We are to seek first what God wants (and that includes the level of our giving) and do what He says, Everything else that we need will be added to us. Tithing 10% is a great place to start but let's not make a legalistic claim out of it. If the HS compells you to give more than 10% then do it. I would encourage people to start with 10% as a biblically based reasonable offering but certainly not be legalistically condemming if someone isn't there yet and needs to work up to it. At the same time, I would challenge all believers to look beyond the 10% and ask what the HS would ask of in terms of personal stewardship and financial giving.
 

I've been raised in church life style and ministry surounding type of environment and I would probably say I feel so messed up with all the stories we now days hear about thithing. Don't I belong t5o God myself? What do I have that I did not recieve from Him? All good gifts come from God the Father says the Word. If I feel the blessings and riches I have come from God the Father, the life I have come from God the Father, why should I ponder about giving Him just a tenth of what He has given me? Christianity today has become a kind of life where people choose to die for God rather than life for Him and with Him. How great and poweful would our Gospel be if christians today understood that God needs a vesel in which "He wants to glorify Himself in power Glory and riches?!" rather than God wants someone available and willing to be the recipient of God's Glory, riches and power.
Personaly I believe that none would give anything if they do not grasp the purpose of what is important in giving or even further more in being where they are. Out of your belly will run rivers of living waters says the Bible and yet I can see some people right under my noze diying for hunger and thirst and that is just because I want to feel full first then look around and see who else should be blessed. Am I not equal to the scribes and phrisies of that time? where have we put the power that indwells in our Gospel? Giving or thithing should never be a question for a christian who lives for God rather then the one who is ready to die for God, if we have got hold of Christ and catch the essence of the substance of the living Word of God. I am always challanged and would like to challange all christian to go back to the Gospel and live a deeper life in the Word of God. Remember:"Deep calls unto the deep"
 

It's better to give 5% or even $5.00 than nothing. God will bless the giver even for that and will work in his/her heart and wallet to bring the person to the "absolutely just" status with Him.
 

jn.3:16 says it all, too many people are talking from head knowledge rather than the heart that is full of giving, the whole gospel is about givingand if one has a problem about giving then you have a problem.The word is settled.Speak and live the word then you will be free to give.
 

WOW, what insightful postings...I do find it very interesting that our churches (America) are so divided on this issue, I guess it is because it deals with money (?? the root of evil??). If I were an unbeliever, I would wonder which version of 'tithing' applies to me, heck I would wonder which version of the Bible ... shoot, I would even wonder which 'version' of Christianity I should go by. I have seen many pastors take a stance on Malachi and proclaim that people are robbing God. Then, take a stance and 'ignite' the people to pray for protection of the 'tax exempt' status but fail to mention 'render unto Ceasar what is Ceasar's'....hmmmm I am so thankful that Jesus laid it all out for us "First love God...second love your neighbor..."
LOVE, isn't that what we are designed to crave? ask any unbeliever and they (we for that matter) will say they are looking for genuine love and acceptance, not merely $
Have a blessed day. rick
 

First, I think that anyone who has to use the title 'pastor' as though it is a first name has got problems to begin with. They lose any credibility in my mind, because they are -- from the start -- seeking to lord it over others and set themselves apart. What a crock.

As for the sow every day, reap every day principle--it's a great sound bite but not a very sound principle--at least with the agricultural world in view. Frankly, seems like there is a lot of focus on money on theat household.
 

So far nobody has mentioned the fact that in the OT the tithe was NOT money, but agriculture- live stock and grain. The only time money was mentioned in regards to tithing was when it was deemed too hard for the Israelites to take their grain and/or livestock to Jerusalem at that one time of the year, instead they were to sell their goods in exchage for money, take the money with them to jerusalem and then SPEND IT ALL on FOOD AND STRONG DRINK! If we therefore follow the model of the OT as if it still exists under the New Covenant, we should all be bringing our cows and corn to church, then slaughtering the cows, cooking the corn and eating it! Oh, and by the way, the tithe wasn't a weekly occurance in the OT, it was a once yearly exercise, off their increase only.
 

It is really interesting how we call anything that requires discipline "bondage". Jesus scolded the Pharisees for giving tithes but not observing the "weightier matters." That is, He indicated that tithing/giving was so foundational that we should not see it as something extraordinary. It is what we should do.

Please note that "tithing" was not established under the law (i.e. Abraham a progenitor of Moses by some 400 years); it was merely institutionalized. I do believe, however, that it stands as a minimum launching pad from develop levels of generous giving.
 

Reading the comments on the tithe, really hurts my heart. It is very evident that a lot of people were hurt by either churches or preachers in the past. it is also eveident that a lot of people gave for the wrong reasons and with the wrong motives. The truth remains that giving is a divine principle, and every true follower of Jesus will never have a problem with giving - not to the poor and neither to the ministry. The bible is clear that God commands that those who preach the gospel should also live by the gospel (1 Cor. 9) I am a preacher of the gospel and would not have been able to have done what i am doing if i had a full time secular job. People are getting saved, blessed and even healed and yet i have been called anything from being lazy to work to robbing God's people. Yet it was the giving of God's people who enable me to continue preaching and teaching the gospel. People let us not get involved in pointless arguments about God's word. let us just apply it to our lives with the correct motive of love towards the Lord and our fellow man. Love gives without expecting anything back.

Jannie van Vuuren - JHB SA
 

It's funny how Pastors say, "the church is not in here, it's out there beyond these walls". And, in the next breath, they want you to contribute to a new building fund.

So much emphasis is on bringing people in, just so we can build a bigger building, a higher podium for the pastor. Why don't we put emphasis on going out.

Yes, the church IS "beyond these walls". I say give 100% of you to God - your time, talents and resources to the REAL church, to ministries in our community, the poor, the elderly, the hurting, the lost - not a building, not to a Pastor who spends the first half of his day on his blog, the second on the golf course, and Sunday mornings preaching why we need to give more. Note to Pastors: Golfing and football are not ministries no matter how you spin it.
 

The question of tithing will go on most likely with out any resolution.
However the intention of the church is what bothers me. I have never given a check to a church or signed an offering envelope. I have however put a lot of cash in the offering plate every week. I recently found out the church does keep really good records of tithing. Also found out they make decisions about you personally, if they don't have a record of you giving! What did Jesus have to say about this? I feel as though I am a client, what is next invoicing from your W2s. I have actually heard of churchs that required you to show them your tax forms. By the way I do not attend church any longer because most care more about the money than they do about the person sitting in the pew.
Maybe God does honor Tithing, he did after all set me free from the church!
 

My parents always fed the poor, sent them to school, pay for their medical expenses, never ask repayment for what they owe - the Lord makes sure we their children are so well provided.
My dad was sargent police and my mother have a little grocery in the Philippines and we are 7 children.

They never preach the Bible - they
live the Living Word.

People does not get paid every hour
so I don't understand why so called ministers of the gospel are always asking for money.

Tithe belongs to churches / ministries that are winning people to Christ.
 

Well, what do we answer Jesus when he rebuked the Pharisees in Luke 11:42, "But how terrible it will be for you Pharisees! For you are careful to tithe even the tiniest part of your income, but you completely forget about justice and the love of God. You should tithe, yes, but you should not leave undone the more important things." (NLT)

Altough the NT is silent about the tithe (apart from this comment), it causes one to pause and rethink the issue. However, I am aware of tithers who are too afraid NOT to tithe.

Makes me wonder about what happened to their "cheerful giving" attitude.
 

I stand for what Minister Steve said.I beleive that God wants a cheerful giver and we must give where the needs are the greatest.

I prefer to give to missionaries, the poor, the hungry, world relief, staff and Pastors. But I will no longer subject myself or family to the bondage of tithing. Only Faith and Obdience please God. He commands to give and 'leads' to give.

Almost all Malaysian churches teach the 10% formula and I have seen many fall for the guilty trap. I would like to thank the editor for blogging on this socially sensitive subject.

Kuala Lumpur MALAYSIA
 

Tithing is a divine principle set forth in Scripture. It is rooted tegologically in the sovereignty of God in our lives. When we tithe, we are recognising that God is the Soverign Lord who owns everything and we are but stewards of what He has given us.

Before the Law, tithing was completely voluntary.Tithing was mentioned for the first time in Genesis 14:17-20. Abram was returning from a war with King Kedorlaomer when he met Melchizedek. Notice what they gave to each other. Melchizedek started by giving Abram "bread and wine" and, in return, Abram gave Melchizedek a tithe. This was a voluntary act of worship, and took place 430 years before the Law was given. It is a beautiful Old Testament picture of Jesus, our Melchizedek, who gave us His body and blood. We, in turn, voluntarily give Him a tithe as recognition of His greatness.

During the Law, tithing was complsory. When the Law of Moses was given to the nation of Israel, tithing was incorporated and the children of Israel were commanded under the Law to tithe. During this time, the tithe was described as "holy unto the LORD". Tithing thus became a compulsory act of obedience.

After the law, we are to tithe willingly. Tithing is mentioned 10 times in the New Testament; three times in the Gospel by Jesus Himself. Jesus did not do away with tithing but took it to a new dimension under grace. He challenged believers to go beond the legalistic righteousness of the Jews. Under the Law, the tithe was the ceiling. However, under grace, the tithe is the floor! The tithe is the starting and not the ending point. It is the least that we can do, out of gratitude for what Jesus has done to set us free.

Friends, consider what Oswald Chabmers said: "Will a Christian who is experiencing intimacy with his Lord wish to take advantage of grace so that he can give less to God's work than the Pharisees who knew nothing about Clvary's love?"

Let those who have ears to hear hear what the Spirit is saying!
 

I believe people should be encouraged to have their own relationshp with God. OPINIONS what place do they have in the Kingdom of God? What about man's interpretations? What place do they have? NONE! By Grace alone we are saved, by grace we receive the annointing and don't need anyone to teach us because he (Jesus and the Holy Spirit) will teach us all things including what we are to give. When we are to give. and TO WHOM we should give. When are we ever going to learn God's word is not designed to be a recipe so that we can make our own cakes without him? We need him. Galations says "walk by the spirit and you are not under law"........if we walk by the spirit will probably end up giving 10 percent or 90 percent or whatever God says to do! That has been my experience. He may say give 100 percent on this day to this person and another time it's 5%. But we are so busy learning laws and rules and regulations and getting too pious about what we know. Just walk by the spirit. And if you don't know how, ask him (Jesus) how. After all if we can't get down that simpple command "walk by the spirit" and ask God how to do that, how can we possibly do or achieve anything else? Get saved, and walk in the spirit. That will lead to everything else in his word, in his timing, perfect timing and he alone will build your testimony. God led me to tithe once when I did not have enough to pay the rent. I obeyed, and someone brought me the rent money the next day because God told them to. But I do not put the Lord to the test and treat that like a recipe. I am willing to let God steer me and change me and I am excited to know what he will do next in my life!
 

TITHING IS NOTHING MORE THAN BONDAGE. Jesus Christ died and set us free from the OT law and its rituals.Jesus established a NEW covenant in His Blood and one of grace.When we tithe we are telling God that His Son's death and resurrection was not good enough. In Galations it says if you keep one thing of the LAW then you have to keep them all; this is saying Christ death was not good enough if we continue to keep OT Law. And yes Abram tenth is under the OT law.The established LAW is Genesis, Exodus, Leviticus, Numbers, and Deuteronomy(Pentateuch,first five scrolls/books). No where in there does Genesis discount Chapter 12 as anything else but the LAW. Tithing was re-instituted by the Roman Catholic church during the rule of Constantinople to get money to refurbish run down cathedrals and build up the finances in the Roman Catholic church. As a matter of fact the Roman Catholics called "tithing" the "unofficial command" of God. When Martin Luther broke away from Catholism and started the Protestant movement there were some things that came along with him from the Catholic church ie... priest wearing robes; the organization of how church should operate; the clergy vs. laymen or congregation and tithing etc... My point is, we still use so much of the Roman catholic tradition in our church or Christianity of today and lots of us try to make it fit in the Bible and it simply does not. Tithe and first fruit are two separate issue but our ministers put them both together to get a better punch for the tithe. If you closley examine the tithe then you will see the only place "GOD" not Abram gave the command of tithe was in Leviticus 27. "GOD" said every TENTH animal that passed under the shepherds rod was the tithe not the first. So animal #10 was holy to God, #20 was holy to God, #30 was holy unto God and so on and so forth if we want to be obedient to the WORD OF GOD. But once again man wants to try to circumvent or improve on what GOD has established to line His own pockets or megachurch. The first fruit is only a sheaf or small gathering or bundle presented to God as a wave offering the day after the Sabbath. If you also noticed with the tithe versus the other offerings God never asked for the best He simply let it be random selection for which animals would be holy to Him or yours to keep and sell or eat. It was like a partnership between God and the shepherd; God did not want to take all of His best animals but at the same time God did not want all of the worst animals either because He was going to give them to the Levites and Priest for thier families to live on and also help with the upkeep of the Temple. Can we see what a loving and caring God we had in this process of tithing. In Malachi the people had went to the process of picking out all of the bad animals to give to God themselves instead of allowing the natural process of selection to take place as "GOD" had established it; disobedience and greed. If Jesus died to fulfill the OT law then you cannot have Malachi 3:8-10 without Lev.27 which gives "GOD'S" instruction of how to perform the tithe. Malachi is simply a history of what the people did with the OT commandments. As a matter of fact every book after deuteronomy is a history or record of what the Israelites did with God's commandments or law. Tithing was a physical act to teach us a spiritual principle and that principle was sharing or giving. It is not for us to try to replicate or do but to learn the spiritual principle from it and do that; the spiritual principle. I no longer tithe after STUDYING God's Word to rightly divide the Word of TRUTH and He is blessing me just fine. I understand that God has already put in effect for His people a law that says "Give and it shall be given back to you good measure, pressed down, shaken together and running over will "man" give into your bosom Luke 6:38. Most people who tithe or give genorously are simply reaping that benefit of giving and its given back because its been established by Almighty God. Most tihers are not reaping the benefits because their hearts are not right anyway in thier giving. I must state that i do believe in "GIVING" and we do give to our church and outside of our church.Tithing just does not line up with scripture for this dispensation of grace and especially the way our pastors and teachers present it. Jesus' death was more than enough for me and i don't have to go back into the tomb and drag out dead issues that He has already put to rest in His death and resurrection. God wants your heart and not your material sacrifices because if He has your heart then He has everything. that's why God has told us in Romans 12 to present our bodies a living sacrifice holy and acceptable to God for that is our reasonable act of service or worship. Its you, its your heart God wants, the church needs the non-eternal things; money.
 

The "tithe" is a lie. That's been proven by those who not only can read, but also UNDERSTAND. This is only one of many lies which today's mainstream churches preach. Unfortunately, (I believe) the pastors believe in what they're preaching ......so, they do it with great fervor. I've heard sermons which not only had me shaking my head (NO) but made me want to stand up an shout "Lies, Lies, Lies!". It's no wonder the church populous is down! People do not want to come under this "Bondage Program".
 

Just some remarks/questions as I've been studying this issue recently.
The tithe was food and as food has to be eaten by people it went to those who didn't have (enough) to eat. Tithe = money is something that man made up. With money you can do a lot of other things but are these things in accord with Gods' intent for the tithe?
The discussion about bending the commands of God to our ability to comply is irrelevant concerning the poor. They were not supposed to tithe as they did not own land or had enough animals. You only started tithing if you had 10 animals or more! So how can we put the poor on the giving side as in the old testament they were on the receiving side of the tithe?
Maybe I didn't read all the postings but I think I missed reading anybody telling that Jesus, Paul, Peter to name a few didn't tithe under the old covenant. Not out of disobedience but they were not supposed to! Only people with produce from land (crops or cattle) were supposed to tithe. It seems to me that most people who stress the importance to obey the command to tithe forget these facts and assume that we walk in the steps of the founders of the church as we tithe.
Forgive me my ignorance but I do not understand how we can build an argument pro tithing from the 10% Abraham gave. He already was rich before he ever gave these 10%. Furthermore he didn't give anything from his personal wealth. What he gave was from the spoils of war. And it was only a one time event. Who can enlighten me?
An other formula I have difficulty to come to grasps with is: the church = the storehouse. Simple math reveals that there is no way the tithe all went to the temple. In that case there would not have been a temple anymore as it would have been completely covered. The reason is, as someone mentioned earlier, that only the levitical tithe went to Jerusalem. If this is true the basis for using Mal. 3 as one of the most important scriptures concerning the way to deal with the tithe/storageroom principle becomes questionable. In that case I would suggest to replace it with deut. 26:12,13 But this would mean revolution in the church because the responsibility of spending the tithe goes to the beliver instead of the storehouse/church.

A primary school student in tithing in need of more teaching.
 

Old Testament Verses New

There are times I'd like to rip out the old testament from every Bible in my house! That is where man was. If you believe in the Christ, you are a New Testament believer and the rules have changed! Read Galations......it's a short book, won't take you long, and it will expose the truth. Best wishes to all who want to follow Jesus.
 

I think God is looking for 100% of my heart and service to him. Tithing has and always will be a man made requirement. Similar to not eating meat on Fridays.
 

I beg of you, seek the truth of the Scripture. My husband and I went so far into debt trying to tithe. We really believed that we were robbing God if we didn't. We had a constant feeling of condemnation and that we weren't pleasing God. We have discovered that by keeping part of an OT law, we were then required to keep the whole law and thereby living under the curse of Deuteronomy 28 (which oddly we kept feeling described our life). Also, if you read Galatians and other Epistles when the Jews were told to stop trying to keep the law, they were told that when they tried to keep it they had removed grace from their lives. What does that say then about our salvation. If the curse of the law is death but living under grace (Jesus, no law attached) gives life.
We kept feeling like we were missing something because our income was dropping and our debt was rising, we and our children suddenly had health problems that we never had before. We tithed instead of paying bills and God did not bless it. However, when the Spirit led us to give to someone to meet a need, He definately blessed it. I'm not talking about name it/claim it theology. I'm talking about NT Spirit led giving. We once gave our gas money to someone because God led us to and supernaturally the gas in the car lasted until my husband got paid again.
We had prayed for an answer but whenever we came across teaching against tithing we thought it was false teaching because it wasn't what was taught in our church. God was trying to show us but we were too stupid to see it. We chose not to look to the Word but to man for answers. When we finally searched the Bible we found the truth.
Last week we stopped tithing and a check for about twice our normal tithe came in the mail. We have peace that we never had the whole time we were tithing. Please read the Word, we are accountable before God for what we do whether we have been deceived or not. We have no excuse, He gave us the Word and Spirt so that we would not be deceived! You can check out my blog for the rest of the story!